Jan
18

Exclusive Interview with Shooter Jennings About XXX

January 18, 2011 - By Trigger  //  News  //  93 Comments

Shooter Jennings’ talk of forming a new genre of music called XXX has been all the talk of this website and others, and a few days ago he offered up an exclusive an extensive interview with Jashie P of Outlaw Radio Chicago about the XXX idea, about his latest and controversial album (to some) Black Ribbons, his feelings on country music and if he has “turned his back on it,” and about his long-standing, one-sided feud with Hank Williams III.

You can listen to the interview in its entirety below in two parts, and for those that would rather read it, the most important points you can find transcribed below as well.

Part 1 – Black Ribbons album, feelings on country

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Part 2 – XXX and Hank III

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Outlaw Radio: What everybody’s been talking about is Black Ribbons, on of the craziest releases of the year. It threw everybody off guard. It is confusing to some people.

Shooter: I was in a place musically where I wanted to do something adventurous and fun. I could have made it a country-esque album, but the idea was much bigger than just doing another record. I knew to stay true to the concept it was going to be a “left field” album and that it would receive mixed reviews. But I felt in my heart that if I did not do something that was exciting to me and fun, then I wasn’t really being true to what music is all about. I absolutely love the country sound of (my) records, and by no means was this record me like “Oh, I going to do these records from now on.”

Outlaw Radio: A lot of people are saying you turned your back on country. You started out with Stargunn, a rock band, and then people say you did country just for the money, and then it didn’t pan out so you went back to rock which is what you always loved and you never had the heart for the country.

Shooter: It’s like an unbelievable book that is being written about me. With Stargunn, we used to do Robert Earl Keen and Charlie Robison, Supersuckers songs, so we were more Southern than we get credit for, like there’s that picture. We were in Nashville and I had this girlfriend and we were just starting out, like, at that point in time, and we took that one fucking picture because we thought we were all cool getting drunk, taking a crazy picture and that thing has haunted me forever. When I started doing country, I didn’t think that country was going to embrace it. We literally put together some songs that I’d been writing over the years, some of which were Stargunn songs and did the first record. And Nashville kind of embraced it, and they put it out and it was kind of a shock. The first two records is when we were in the best place we could have possibly been. It was going really well.

It wasn’t until we started doing The Wolf where really, Leroy (Powell) was drifting, he was in his own place. I love Leroy, but at that point he just checked out, and I was trying to hold this band together and it was the most sad time period. A lot of the songs on The Wolf, even though it is people’s least favorite record, were really songs about me trying to keep it together. Here we were in a good place, and it was all imploding because Leroy was just so negative. And he’ll admit that. The minute that record came out, the head of Universal South changed, and there was this guy there that was a big league producer that had done all these cheeseball Nashville records. They didn’t know what to do with us, and the minute we hit the road I said we were dragging a dead wolf around. It was a dead record. We had no support.

And these people will write the dialogue for whatever is happening and they will have another chapter for whatever else I do next, but I do know it has always been a very pure thing. There’s never been a dragon being chased. I’m just not like that.

Outlaw Radio: Where is the best place to get the album (Black Ribbons)?

Shooter: It’s being re-released on February 8th. The thing is like Target, and a couple of other places like Best Buy did not want to carry it because–if this is not the stupidest thing ever–they are basically pressuring artists and labels to cut albums that are ten songs or under so that they can sell them for $9.99 and compete with iTunes. They feel like they can’t do that with a 15-song record because they want to sell .99 cents a song. We’re not doing that, but with doing a ten song version, which is a bastardization of the record and I’ll be the first to say that, but their selling point to me on this is that if we do this, we can get it into Target and then we’ll have a thing inside the record to point people to where they can get the rest of it. That’s why they did this “bullet” version of it.

Outlaw Radio: It’s been brought to our attention that you and Adam Sheets are trying to start, I don’t know if you want to call it a new genre called XXX. How about you explain the idea of it and how it all came about.

Shooter: I had this idea about 5 years ago. I really felt like artists like myself, Hank III, Scott Biram, I just felt like there was this really unfair thing. Nothing there will get exposed in the mainstream format unless you have kind of one shitty pop song on the album. In the rock format or the rap format, whatever is the edgiest, newest, and freshest makes it. They were progressive mediums, and with country music it never felt that way, you have to have a cheesy ballad or something to even get any exposure, which seems to me as bending the artist to something that they’re not to get it to work, which always seems unfair to me. So back then I kind of made up this thing, and where the XXX came from.

When we were thinking of a name, the reason I went with XXX is, even though I know there’s a million reasons that it’s not a good idea was that A, it doesn’t mention anything that associates it with another genre, like country, or Southern, or bluegrass. The moonshine thing is kind of the pun of it. Really it’s more of the southern culture of that than it is the alcohol. So I wrote to Adam Sheets, me and him have become good friends, and he really was knowledgeable in a lot of this. I reached out to him to get a more well-rounded list of what this could be. I am not ultimately right about this. The overall importance of it is trying to find a way to, trying to find a single flag that all these people can fly under. Because once you put that concept out there, I think it starts to really open up the possibilities for a lot of these artists. Everybody out there is hurting because they don’t have this exposure.

Everybody is out there fighting their own little wars out there, and I feel like we’re all on one side of the battlefield. And if we were all to unite on one side that it would be just so much better for us and everybody. I’m not considered the most underground dude in the world or anything. I had some radio coverage off the first album, but they outcast me immediately. I feel like all of these artists, all have songs that are phenomenally, that are really catchy, and really interesting and definitive. And I feel like there’s a giant audience of people that don’t know it exists, and if they did, they would never turn on country radio again.

Outlaw Radio: What do you think all these names are going to do? What is this petition, what exactly are you trying to get with having people sign up? I mean you’re over a thousand now.

Shooter: My dream would be to get that number to the 40-50,000 name range, because armed with something like that, we can say “Hey, here are 50,000 people who believe in this cause.” This is not aimed at one person. The more people that sign on saying “I believe in this,” that’s an example written in stone that can be given to a festival company, a radio station to do a weekend show. As much as CMT and GAC are the pop mainstream enemy, if they were to see enough of a value to put up like a 120 minute show that covered all this stuff. Having a petition is kind of like a weapon in a way.

Outlaw Radio: I can’t let you go without asking you about Hank III.

Shooter: The whole thing was so weird. First off I didn’t rip him off. I wasn’t aware of that song of his. The whole Put The O Back In Country came about as a joke, and I had no idea he was about this record out that had this song on it. When that came it, it was weird because I’d only met him twice in my life, once for about 30 seconds, and once for about 4 minutes. The other time was when I was like 12-years-old and I played ‘Monster Truck Madness’ with him on the computer, on the internet, like on dial-up. He whipped my ass. He was very nice when I met him. And I didn’t understand because I liked his music. I never understood why we weren’t on the same team. We could have done so much. It’s sad because all these years later, I mean neither one of us are rich, he’s probably as broke as I am. I don’t think we did as much damage as we could have done together. If we had been touring together, I think we would have built one hell of a joint fan base. I always tried to never engage in it because I never agreed. I liked his music.

It was funny because he would say in an article like “We’re not commercial assholes, if we were we would be like Shooter Jennings,” and I’d be “I’m not selling out, what are you talking about? I’m definitely not selling a lot of records. I’m not driving around in an expensive car, you know what I mean? Like were both hurting dude. Dierks Bentley is selling out, not me.” I would like to bury that hatchet. I mean if it was up to me, I would say if we ever get this XXX up and running, let’s bury the hatchet right there. I’m not holding a grudge against him. I’m absolutely of the mind that if there’s ever been a time that guys like him and me need to work together, it’s like now. Music is getting worse. It’s selling worse. We’re in a very fragile time, and artists like us, I feel if we were to bond together, it would be a really strong thing.

Outlaw Radio: You have always taken the high road, and I think people respect you for that. The reason I brought that up with Shelton the last time I had him on the show is because I saw an interview with you on YouTube, you were backstage at the Warped Tour, and you gave him a shout out. I think you said “Check out Justin Townes Earle and Hank III.” After everything, you respect him for the music he’s making.

Shooter: Of course, and I respect him for the things he’s doing in music. Like I see his influence all over the place, I see how he’s helped other artists. There’s been a lot of areas where Shelton has done a very good job.

I was in Nashville for a like a day, it’s been about two years ago. And I was standing outside of a restaurant, I was eating with my mom and with ‘bama (his daughter) and Drea (de Matteo), a couple of friends and we were about to leave town. And I’m standing outside and somebody honks and says “Shooter!” I have terrible eyesight but I’m looking across the street and there’s this big truck and some guy waving, and I was like “Oh Hey!” And he’s like “Long time enemy!” and then revs his truck and pulls off and it was Hank, it was Shelton. I was like “Alright, that was kinda weird.”

Outlaw Radio: Give people one good reason to sign up at www.givememyxxx.com.

Shooter: If you go to givememyxxx.com and you look at that list, and if you’re listening to this you’re going to like a lot of the music on there. The one good reason is because this music is so much better than most of the music that gets exposure out there, and its like these bands deserve to have their names out there, to have there music out there. And you signing this petition is sayin “I believe in these artists, they they deserve to be heard by more people than they’re being heard by.” That to me is what it’s about.

93 Comments to “Exclusive Interview with Shooter Jennings About XXX”

  • Sounds like Shooter’s trying to take the high road. If he’s sincere about wanting to bury the hatchet with Hank III and is sincere about this new “xxx” genre, I think it’d do everyone involved a lot of good if fences were mended between those two. Sounds like they’re basically after the same thing…a viable outlet for their music and the music of so many others who go unnoticed because they’re not playing ball with big corporate radio or record companies.

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    • both shooter and hank iii could certainly take easier paths than they have. i believe them both to be honest and sincere about their passions and their work.
      hopefully, this works.

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      • Yes, either of them could have taken their names and been huge as country-pop superstars. That they didn’t speaks volumes.

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        • I think it speaks to their bloodlines as well beyond a concious decision. It isn’t in them to just follow the leader, or do something they are not wholly committed to.

          Plus, given the large shadow the families cast, I wouldn’t expect them to want to have just settled into the pop-country world. They wouldn’t have fit at all. If they sang what their dad’s did, that wouldn’t have made the cut.

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  • You know I was never really a Shooter fan. I would like to tell you that there was more to it than me blindly siding with Hank III, but there probably wasn’t. I hadn’t really listened to his music other than catching the Shooter/Jamey Johnson Crossroads on TV. It felt a little contrived to me, but then again they always do because I don’t think the bands get enough rehearsal before the show. Having said all that…Shooter really comes off like a decent guy. In fact, I decided to sign the petition and I’m going to get one of his albums off Amazon. Of course I will do this by searching on the link to Amazon off SCM.com (wink).

    The first time that I met Hank III (probably 2006 or so), I asked him if he would consider doing anything with Shooter in the future. I guess this was pretty much in the heart of their “feud” which I was unaware of at the time. His answer was something like, “Maybe a little further on down the road.” I thought it was interesting at the time because he definitely didn’t say, “No.” Perhaps we are far enough down the road?

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    • I think it is important for people to understand that they don’t have to like Shooter’s music, or even Shooter as a person to be behind this XXX idea. I think one of the reasons it has grown some legs is because Shooter has proven himself a standup guy, who is willing to engage his critics and listen to their criticism and put past grievances asides for the good of the idea. He has said he doesn’t want to be the leader of this, but this is the textbook definition of leadership.

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  • Wow, what a good read. That would be pretty amazing if III signs on. I’m very interested in seeing how this thing goes. Hopefully these guys can make it happen.

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  • Great interview Jahshie. Shooter sounds like a seriously nice, sincere guy. Shockingly, nobody has mentioned him in this thread yet so let me be the first: Jamey Johnson!

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    • Damn, 5 minutes too late!

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      • Haha. Sorry. Six degrees of Jamey Johnson.

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  • Great interview.

    I found it funny that Shooter mentioned Dierks Bentley. Only because of all the atists he could have named as a sell out, Dierks was kind of out of left field. That either maybe was just a random thought, or means that Dierks was someone that sold out bigtime. Guessing bigtime sell out, given Dierks does great Bluegrass, but clearly gave that up a while back and took the label money.

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    • I shouldn’t have mentioned ANYBODY as far as a sellout goes. Look Dierks is fine, he’s got his bluegrass records, etc. It’s all part of the same monster. A system that I never fit into or felt a part of, yet got shoved into many times. I regret name calling him, as there are surely others who deserve it more. Oh well. And I am aware of Hellbound Glory, I just didn’t know Leroy’s name, but since the interview, I’ve LOVED listening to their music. Thanks for all the kind words guys…

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      • I wondered if that was the case about Leroy, I know Hellbound Glory opened for you a few months back. They are a great, great band, glad you’re enjoying it!

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  • I was surprised at that comment as well. Dierks new album is a good bluegrAss record, bu too little too late I suppose.

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    • I also found Shooter’s lack of knowledge on “Hellbound Glory” telling as well.

      That shows how far this movement has to go. When Shooter Jennings is dropping random thoughts on Dierks Bentley, and has ZERO idea of a great band like Hellbound.

      Not his fault, but shows the mess things are in. Not to mention Hank III is no where to be found, and most likely has no idea of many of any bands. Again, not his fault, but really more on us fans to think about who we “wish” would save the music, and who actually is in a realistic position to save the music, aren’t even close.

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    • I was surprised to the mention of Dierks as well. I really did feel he sold out on the previous album before his new bluegrass one. The song “Sideways” on the previous album was soo horrible. The new bluegrass album I think is great though. I don’t know if we can blame artists like Dierks really though, it sounds like he was probably put in the same position as most artists in Nashville and he realized it and decided he needed to change things after that album. At least he didn’t keep making shitty songs like Trace Adkins. He would be my top Nashville artist who has sold out.

      I think it’s great to hear Shooter explain his XXX idea and his previous fued with III. Shooter comes across to me as just another country music fan like all of us who see’s this need for these great underground artists to get noticed by the rest of the world. He may not know about all these great artists but seems to know quite a few. Again as mentioned above by others if III or Shooter haven’t heard of artists like Hellbound Glory, it just provides proof that there needs to be a single source for the public to find and hear about these bands.

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      • Dierks has a Bluegrass album out?

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        • Hell no Misfit…that ain’t no Bluegrass record.At least not the Bluegrass that Monroe,Jimmy Martin,Ralph and Carter, Red Allen and Charlie Moore played. You’re not missing a thing buddy.

          Somebody on here called The Carolina Chocolate Drops bluegrass here a while back…
          Lordy.

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          • I thought maybe he came from a bluegrass background and there may be something to it..

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          • Paul, you ever heard the Bentley bluegrass album? Or just the song “Up on the Ridge” the radio played? Did you know McCoury’s were on the album when you said it was NOT bluegrass and not worth the time.

            Do you know that Kris Kristofferson, Allison Krause, Punch Brothers are on the album too.

            But now you say “ah, McCoury’s are the real deal, so ok, it is kinda bluegrass, i guess.”

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        • Dierks does have a bluegrass album out. And it isn’t bad. Is it- Monroe,Jimmy Martin,Ralph and Carter, Red Allen and Charlie Moore. Probably not, of course your taking some icons in Bluegrass.

          Dierks has put at least one bluegrass song on every album prior to “Up On The Ridge”, and he has a bluegrass background and love. He has been friends with several bluegrass acts for some time…example- Del McCoury.

          I am not trying to excuse songs like “Sideways” and his last mainstream album, but I don’t think it is fair to say “Up On The Ridge” isn’t bluegrass.

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          • I agree. I’m not comparing his album at all to bluegrass greats like Monroe, Flatt & Scruggs, Del McCroury. But it’s a good take on a modern version of bluegrass keeping it somewhat traditional.

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          • Same thing that happened to country music has happened to Bluegrass. It’s been watered down and made “modern” to appeal to a new audience. It’s not working. I understand that Dierks is friends with the McCoury clan, and they appear on the record. The McCoury’s are the real deal. Ok.
            Dierks is as Bluegrass as he is country. Fair enough?

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          • Why is Dierks not bluegrass? Do you know him? Met him? Talked with him?

            I think with this Shooter interview, we can all talk a note about assumptions of artists based on music alone.

            Dierks other albums had some pretty good tunes on them. Most that made radio were sappy, but he also has some good bluegrass and country songs.

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          • Paul, you ever heard the Bentley bluegrass album? Or just the song “Up on the Ridge” the radio played? Did you know McCoury’s were on the album when you said it was NOT bluegrass and not worth the time.

            Do you know that Kris Kristofferson, Allison Krause, Punch Brothers are on the album too.

            But now you say “ah, McCoury’s are the real deal, so ok, it is kinda bluegrass, i guess.”

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          • I’ve heard it. It’s “bluegrass-esqe.” That’s all I can say. The old “what is Bluegrass anyway” argument has gone on ever since Flatt and Scruggs added a dobro and a snare drum.
            Have I met Dierks Bentley? Yep. He used to hang at The Station Inn. Met him a couple times backstage at The Opry. Nice enough guy. I know he is Bluegrass friendly. I don’t have a problem with the man.

            Hell, I like Alison Krauss, but I don’t consider her music Bluegrass either. Bluegrass influenced Americana perhaps?

            That’s neither here nor there,as my opinion doesn’t matter a whole lot.

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          • That is great. Maybe you could explain that rather than say, and your opinion does matter when you say, “Hell no Misfit…that ain’t no Bluegrass record.”

            Sure sounds like it is a bluegrass-esque record.

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          • Im not wanting to argue about whats Bluegrass and what isnt but I am going to check out some of his stuff just out of curiosity. One tune I have heard did have a Banjer and a Mando but that does not mean constitute it being a Bluegrass tune. So I understood where Paul is coming from. He was simply informing me it wasnt traditional. Its certainly not traditional BG and im not sure I’d call it contemporary. I think Id just call it country with a mando and banjer.. :) Either way this isnt the time place for this discussion as there are already sparring matches elsewhere.. Wheres the popcorn?

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  • Yeah, Hank doesn’t even know bands he has promoted in the past. I think Shooter is trying to discover these bands, hence why he got Adam on board and asked me to email him every band he should check out. He knows they are out there.

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    • I’ve never heard one of your interviews, and don’t have a lot of time to catch the broadcasts, but I thought you allowing Shooter to talk as much as you did was excellent. Not ever interview can allow for that, but letting him ramble about the topics you brought up, did allow him to fully explain the issues and provide support.

      I didn’t agree with the “XXX” name, but how he explained the reason for the name from a “radio format” standpoint, and counter format to “AAA” makes sense. Based on that, I don’t think XXX really would be something you would ever hear a DJ say “Today’s best XXX music on 92.5″
      But you might have some radio executives sitting around saying “we don’t want to do the top 40 format. Lets consider the XXX format.”
      From that, if that conversation ever happened, and mainstream radio started playing XXX format, then a “name” of the genre might be born.

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      • I’m in the same boat on that one. I had visions of walking into a record store and having to find the XXX section, and it made me cringe. But, he’s done a good job of explaining it, and I agree as a radio format, or as the title of a TV or radio show, it doesn’t work that badly at all

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    • How could he not know about many of these bands already? I mean he has had his OWN radio show on Sirius’ “Outlaw Country” for years!? That’s just lazy. Glad to hear he is interested in learning. Hopefully his show will improve!

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      • He probably knows about a lot of bands YOU don’t know, just as he doesn’t know every band a fan knows.

        These guys are human and do have their own circles and lives they run in.

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        • I am a little bit familar with what bands Shooter knows about judging by what he plays on his show… Most of it is half-assed shit and little of it could be considered country by-any-stretch. Just seems odd that being the case on what is supposed to be “Outlaw Radio”. But like I said, hopefully his show will get better and I do commend him for his XXX idea. He’s trying…

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    • thats too cool

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  • Thanks for the kind words man. I appreciate that.

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  • Shooter is passionate about it, I feel, and that is one step in the right direction. I don’t care, I don’t like XXX. Never will. Concocts negativity all the way around: three strikes you’re out, family feud(survey says), porn(I don’t watch it). Malcom X, xtasy, xrated, and so on and so forth. I think, given so many are so passionate about it, that someone can give it the proper label. Just my thoughts, take it or leave it, but I don’t like it. I’m sure I’m not alone. But I will continue to explore the real music, regardless, just not ON XXX.

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  • Just call it Real Country. :)

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    • The problem is that a lot of the bands aren’t real country. Sure all of them fit into country music better than Tim McGraw and all of them incorporate elements of country, but most of them also have other aspects to their work, be it rock, punk, metal, bluegrass, blues, folk, etc.

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      • “but most of them also have other aspects to their work, be it rock, punk, metal, bluegrass, blues, folk, etc”.

        Yeah that could be summed up in two words Muddy Roots. Got a festival with bands from “your list” I will name then now to remind you.

        HELLBOUND GLORY
        LAST FALSE HOPE
        POSSESSED BY PAUL JAMES
        TEN FOOT POLECATS
        WAYNE HANCOCK

        Thats just naming a few of the great bands that your talking about being XXX

        All the info you need is right there http://www.muddyrootsmusic.com

        A common ground can be found make time to work this out. Tell me why Shooter is here commenting on this and paying close attention to how we all feel about this. Promote Muddy Roots Music Fest i posted on No Depression about it and you say not on word about it. There is a Fest!!! Get behind it work with what all these fine folks i call my family worked to build. You my friend are a bad voice for this. I vote we pick another person to work with Shooter that will make a common ground here. This can be done. I want Shooters help to get this up and running. I have nothing but respect for Shooter but your views on what we all live and breath are single minded. You Adam just dont understand what it will take to get these people on the same page. Your dealing with the real deep underbelly of folks here that pull all kind of miracles to get these artists voice heard.

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        • I respect the Muddy Roots Festival and what y’all are doing and have no idea why Kyla and Kim haven’t made sure the word got out to the No Depression community. With that said, I’ve already stated elsewhere why anything using the word “roots” isn’t going to attract attention on a massive scale. Guys like me and you are the exceptions. We’re the guys who wanna seek out old hillbilly and blues records from the ’20s and ’30s, but for most people “roots” is a euphemism for old and in a musical landscape dominated by Taylor Swift, it just ain’t gonna work. The Muddy Roots Festival sounds like an awesome place for the converts to gather to hear some great music. What the XXX Festival will be is where the people go to be converted. Anybody thinking one festival- be it Muddy Roots or XXX- is gonna get the job done needs to look at this on a larger scale. We need Muddy Roots and we need XXX. We also need some fans to get inspired and start their own festivals. It takes a lot more than one.

          Thanks for pointing out that I’m a bad voice for this, by the way, considering that many of the artists who are currently on board are there due to me sending an e-mail their way, getting them in touch with Shooter, and publicizing this via No Depression. You and some of the folks on here seem to have more of a connection to many of the more underground artists than I do and it’s definitely gonna take more than me “working with Shooter.” It’s going to take you working with the artists you know, Jashie working with artists he knows, Shooter working with those he knows, and so on. Two people won’t get the job done, but please don’t disrespect the contributions I’ve already made to this in getting artists on board.

          Are my views single-minded? Hell yes and I say that proudly. My one and only goal is to see that these artists get the credit they deserve. That’s what I’ve always been about, whether in decrying how much the top 40 and Nashville sucked before this site ever existed and before I ever chose writing as a profession, writing about great artists on No Depression when nobody else would (there are still some great unsigned country artists I’ve written about over there that you guys haven’t picked up on over here yet), going to shows to support independent artists and spreading the word about those shows and those artists to ANYBODY who would listen, or in helping Shooter develop this list (he deserves most of the credit, but I put a few of the more unknown names there myself.) If that isn’t your one and only goal, then I’m afraid we’re after two very different things.

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          • So your just really wanting to start your own thing. I understand now. Your making all so clear.

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          • Nope, I just want us to all work together, Muddy Roots, XXX, and any other like-minded festival that comes along. Help each other out.

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        • And as we’ve already stated numerous times, I’m not the leader of the XXX thing and neither is Shooter. We all are. Artists, fans, podcasters, bloggers, promoters, good independent labels. It’s about all of us.

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          • Then build on whats already happening WHY cant you understand. Thats what these people want. You to support what we do. Work together cant you get that.

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          • We are supporting what is already happening. That’s the whole point. I believe Shooter has even expressed interest in playing at Muddy Roots. He’s willing to work with you. Are you willing to work with him and put the same interest behind XXX (or whatever the name ends up being) as he has put behind Muddy Roots? These are two grassroots efforts that when put together becomes one strong effort. Hell, do you want my word on it? I am broke at the moment, but I will do everything within my power to try to make it to Muddy Roots and support y’all. Will you say the same thing about XXX? Because from where I’m standing it seems that Shooter and I have listened to all of your suggestions and even changed givememyxxx.com to reflect some of them.

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          • Yes i will. What everybody wants is a common ground. If you get in with these people and help them they will in turn help you. From what im seeing is that you want everybody to just be ok xxx thats it we got it ya see you there. When in turn there has been and will always be the CORE roots of grassroots and thats were you at. If this xxx team or what ever happens being Shooter as a larger voice to promote Muddy Roots you damn well better believe these people will support what ever it is your trying to do myself included. We want your help need your help. BUT you got to show these fine folk what your true intentions are. Kinda work you way up into being respected. Im small at this but do you wanna know why 20 or 30 people will go buy a album and go see shows and listen to what i say? Because for years i have offered my own money to give free hotel rooms to bands i have a special rate at the hotel i work at just for bands i will go way out my way to help book a show and get people there. I interviewed people got them fans i earned my place at this table took my money to start a show to play music that folks needed to hear. I built on what they had laid before me. If Shooter does the same i will help him. But im not for starting a new festival right out the gate. Work with Muddy Roots. work hard cause it does need to happen never said it dont.

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          • Cool, man. It seems like we’re both on the same page now. The only disagreement I have is that we DO need another festival and in fact more than one. There are literally dozens of rock festivals, punk festivals and jazz festivals. If we want to compete with that we can’t do it with Muddy Roots alone.

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          • No you cant. But you start with working with these people that make Muddy Roots Deep Blues and so on happen. We need a damn good talk all of us. I think if i could just explain what i mean about all this we would come to a common ground.

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          • Just so you know, Deep Blues Festival 2011 is happening…announcement will be made this week sometime (most likely). Very grassroots this time around, one day/night event in July. Stay tuned for mo’ info.

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          • You two seem to have a good conversation going about fests, but from the interview, I got the sense XXX is a whole lot bigger than a fest or group of fests. And these fests that are held, although a ton of hard work goes into them, and you draw tens of thousands of fans, it hasn’t done much to shake the ground of corporate radio/labels.

            As Shooter described XXX as a “format”, that is what can shake things up. I agree that the festivals are helpful, but as Adam has pointed out, you need more than just Muddy Roots. Example- Muddy Roots doesn’t mean a thing to fans up here in MN.

            Also, there is a cold hard truth to face sometimes too. If a fest or artist can’t survive, they can’t. Not everyone gets a trophy everytime, and somethings need to be cut loose to move forward. Example- painful to say, but one guy isn’t going to save country music. Not HankIII, not Shooter. The dream of that is over. Not Leroy Virgil, not Jamey Johnson. Not alone at least.

            I am much more on board with this XXX idea after hearing this interview. The supporters of Muddy Roots might have to take a step back and see that they fit the XXX idea. Forget the name for the moment, I think we have clairification it isn’t going to be a section in a record shop or call sign for a radio show, but that idea is to reel in everyone. It is more a huge “network”. Not one fest, not one radio hour.

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          • The supporters of Muddy Roots might have to take a step back and see that they fit the XXX idea.

            FUCK THAT XXX Need to see that they fit into what we do why are you here at SCM cause we really get shit done period. We are the ONLY media outlet for this music the ONLY one I will support this IF and only IF they support us. You cant expect everyone to jump ships THEY have worked hard for Muddy Root fucking aint nobody stepping back. They have to Step up. THATS WHY SHOOTER is here not anyplace else. Yall are making me sick Just because its Shooter we dont have to listen he is just a person trying to get in on this. Maybe if someone could tell Shooter the real scoop this might get some place. I want him to help just not with Adam in is ear giving the wrong info.

            And FYI this is driving a huge wedge between friends and supporters of Saving Country Music Hillgrass Bluebilly Stink Finger Radio Outlaw Radio and so on…tearing down walls that were built years before this…..

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          • Rev. Nix-
            Ok. I think we can see how discussions go with this.

            I will disagree- “We are the ONLY media outlet for this music”

            Thats strange, cause I have heard a lot of this music elsewhere. I found a lot of this music before I came on this site. The bands and media I listen to brought me here, not the other way around.
            In fact, I never have listened to one show through this site. I am sure they are good, but to be honest, trying to explain that I listen to a show called “Stinkfinger” is more tasking than explaining the XXX format.

            Not to discredit radio shows supported through this site, but they reach a very small segment. It appears that XXX is hoping to broaden that and provide a vehicle to take this movement to another level.

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          • Rev. Nix, you seem to be giving me too much credit and also giving yourself too much credit as being “the only media outlet for these artists.” We’re beating a dead horse here now, but ever since this idea has been brought to SCM all Shooter and I have done is listen to each and every one of your ideas, consider them, and in many instances, changed the site to reflect them. I think I’m going to suggest when I talk to him later that we should add a section about supporting the existing movement and festivals like Muddy Roots and SCM live. I think that would clear up a lot of the confusion people around here seem to have about what our goals are and where our hearts are on this.

            For the record, Shooter Jennings is not going to cancel Muddy Roots. He neither has the power nor the interest in doing that and has even stated he would like to join the lineup of Muddy Roots. He also is not going to force you to label your music “XXX.” Call it what you want. We’re all working together on this to bring the music we all love to the masses. Yes, there is room for improvement and we know that. There is also room for far more than one festival.

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        • I totally think Muddy Roots is as important as SCM and all it’s associates, HBE, and what we’re doing. I added them to the links, I think having their input on this too could help…

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      • Adam, with due respect, in my opionion the early country, at least the outlaw period was punk in nature in that it infuriated the staus quo, just as punk infuriated the radio and mainstream status quo in it’s own time.I have always believed that punk is as much an attitude as a genre, and if ever there were punks in the early Nashville days it was Waylon Jennings & Johnny Cash. I for one view punks and outlaws as one and the same.
        I undersand and can respect the purist desire to keep county unadulterated and within it’s original roots and intention, but I personally think that country and punk are a mix meant to be, in that they are similar bedfellows, left out together in the cold. Mainstream radio will not play REAL country and they will not play REAL punk. So why shouldn’t these two estranged outcasts bond together and thumb their collective noses at the commercial whores that ostracied them, and blaze a path unlike what others may concieve as normal. This is what I have done.

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    • I know what your saying Denise. I’m for this XXX label. But what it all boils down to is what really needs to be done is the existing music genres need to be completely revamped. So that when someone says country they they know they are gonna hear Whitey Morgan, Dale Watson, or Wayne Hancock. and then have subgenres such as pop country, southern rock, bluegrass, goth country, hick hop, folk, etc.

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      • I look at that way already. Pop-country is a sub-genre. It just happens to be the one that is on the mainstream radio for this era.
        A movement like XXX, could move the next sub-genre into play. Because pop-country is losing steam.

        The opportunity is there to make a move. But people have to be willing to compromise (that doesn’t mean sellout, or lose your individuality) . But given the fact that some on here seem to look at any compromise as giving in or selling out, or any success as selling out, it makes it tough to move forward.

        Denise doesn’t like the name, as others including myself have said too, but listen to the interview and how Shooter explains the name. It makes sense how he came up with it. And I am willing to concede/compromise that the name is what it is for now, to move forward.

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        • That’s exactly how I look at it too right now. I have noticed that it is losing steam and I think that’s because the labels and artists are starting to introduce new ideas such as adding rap and reggea to songs..ie Sugarland and Aldean, and songs are becoming even more poppy sounding. It’s causing their listeners to look somewhere else. I’ve noticed this with alot of my friends who do listen to mainstream country like Taylor Swift…yes I am friends who like her..haha! but I’ve talked to them about all this and even though they like Taylor they realize the music is no longer country at all and are a little annoyed by it. They just aren’t as up in arms as I am about it all. I think most people especially most women, just take whatever is spoonfed to them and don’t care as much as we all do.

          I’m planning on going to Muddy Roots this year, which I’m excited about except it’s on Labor Day Weekend, which is usually my one great weekend to be on the lake.

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          • I think one of the bigger issues we are gonna face is if this takes off it’s no longer considered “underground” country and I know alot of people on this site subconsciously like their music being considered “underground”. There’s a fine line we are all gonna walk as fans and artists as to what some would call being a sellout. As long as the artists don’t change their sound and creativity for the greed we are all good in my opinion.

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          • I agree that as things take off, that underground label will be lost or it will be used to describe the movement, but it won’t be underground anymore.
            I too think that some fans like having that label to their music and won’t want to let it go for anything.

            There are some artists we might see that have had success in the mainstream, but really are partial to being less pop. I think Dierks might be an example of that. Shooter also mentioned Pat Green too.

            Does current/past success with mainstream, or being on a Colt Ford song, destroy your credit with being someone that actually loves true country music and wants to make that music again?

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    • Look, everyone needs to chill out. XXX has NOTHING to do with Muddy Roots. Muddy Roots is not going to be canceled! Muddy Roots is not going to be incorporated by Shooter Jennings for his own enterprise that he can exploit. Don’t take rumors you see on Facebook and bring them to this site! This thing is in its infant stages. If it is dividing people, it is because there is fear and misunderstanding, NOT because of any specific actions or plans for actions. Everything is still in the planning stages, including the name. So take a deep breath, and if you read something on Facebook, take it with a grain of salt!

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      • I second that.

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      • I third it.

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      • I was also going to suggest a chill pill. Considering I am the founder of Muddy Roots I can say we are planning to rock out this September in Tennessee and all are welcome. Obviously this is a sensitive issue for all of us as we all are very passionate about the music we enjoy and don’t want it torn apart as the industry tends to do. Shooter can contact me direct if he is interested in talks with Muddy Roots as well as you all can.

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  • Great interview Jashie, Thanks for the post Triggerman.

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  • Such a shame it’s dividing walls, because it is a common ground we all want to stand on. The concept is important to the evolution of music. But if y’all can’t come to an agreement, if you can’t see how the XXX symbol, genre or what you may want it to incorporate, causes problems then the machine behind the movement is blinded and stubborn. Yes there needs to be a breakaway from country/popcountry. The name sucks. And for me to talk about it to my peers, my family and loved ones, I’m not going to want to explain it that deeply.

    “you see, it says XXX. But it doesn’t mean XXX.”

    “What does it mean then?”

    Well, these guys want to change the way you look at country music . . .

    By tagging an xrated theme to it?

    Well . . . uh . . . hmmmmm.

    Real country. Not pop. Not alternative. Not Nashville Music Row. REAL.

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    • I don’t know if you listen to the radio shows through this site, but how would you explain listening a show/podcast like “Stinkfinger” or “When I Pee it Burns”.

      “Hey everybody, I heard a great band on when I pee it burns the other day”

      “I listen to stinkfinger radio.”

      Thats screams of country music and a classy group.

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      • wow icecold, i feel so low class now for listening to stinkfinger, i think i better just stop. thanks to this gleaming nugget of fuckin wisdom i’ve been shown the error of my fuckin scumbag ways. as soon as i’m done typing this i’m off to flush my stash.thanks too, icecold, for straightening out the triggerman on the messiah theory which you so wisely and boldly declared dead. where would we all without such an enlightened mind repudiating our fuckin ludicrous assumptions.

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        • Crook, I don’t know you at all, and you don’t know me. All you seem to do on here is curse about other people. And offer nothing in the way of constructive conversation or to question a view point.

          I was asking Denise, and I agree with her on the challenge about the name XXX, but when she said it would be hard to explain to family, friends that XXX is a music, I was simply stating that explaining XXX (I agree would be strange) but no more strange than stinkfinger or it burns when I pee.

          those two phrases don’t exactly say “country music” nor are they something that would be picked up by a corporate backer any easier than XXX name.

          I wasn’t calling anyone low class, but the arguement Denise makes also can apply to somethings that she appears to support.

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          • i fuckin apologize for fuckin misunderstanding yer fuckin tone as fuckin implying fuckin otherwise.

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          • maybe if you would learn to read past the first two words of something before jumping to a fuckin conclusion, you might not mis-fuckin-understand things.

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          • funny, i was thinkin that bout you. i tell ya man, i’m past my fill of this shit. you been commenting here like what, 2 weeks and you’re callin me out for talkin shit. i read these blogs for the past two years and didn’t comment for over a year til i felt i was up to speed.who, the polite man asks, in fuck do you take yourself for? maybe you’re the messiah, i don’t know. like you said i don’t know you, i don’t know which artists you actually support though you made it abundantly clear how strongly you dislike one of my all-time favorites so maybe i’m just a jilted Bob Wayne fan. what, in those comments, was constructive? and who do i curse about besides you?people can say what they feel without worrying about saving the world or steppin on toes, a little thing called opinion and there’s this old saying on this subject.i dont know man, i guess we just fuckin see shit differently and I’ll leave it at that.

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          • I believe I explained to you why Bob Wayne doesn’t do it for me, rather than just saying fuck bob wayne. Or going off on a curse laced vent. I don’t have a problem with you liking him. I get his message, I just don’t like the delivery.

            I have read a lot of blogs, for awhile as well, before I began to comment.

            I support nearly every artist. I even support Bob for what he is trying to do, it just isn’t my kind of thing. I might not go to a concert of his, but him being part of this underground doesn’t turn me off to it.

            I have read a lot of articles and responses that rip artists I really like, but I try to not let that get in my way of the bigger picture which is pop-country sucks. But every artist that has a radio hit doesn’t suck.

            For the most part there are good conversations and debate on here. But there are a handful that if you don’t see it their way, or like their artist, or like some artist they don’t, they tell you to fuck off. Which is fine, but, if that is all you have to say, just read and don’t comment.

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          • you just cant help it can you? that whole last sentence is outta line man and for me its where you go wrong every damn time. tell me how you feel, that’s everyone’s right in my opinion, but dont fuckin tell me what to do or not do. and my big picture isnt “pop country sucks”, its that this music i support is fuckin great, a slight yet important difference. and now you claim you support Bob when previously you told me that “he threatens country music…i just dont like people like him.” hmmm, guess i dont get that either. but in candor i take this music seriously, these conversations much less so and i type these words with no malice, just a smile. if i ever come to minnesota to see a charlie parr show or somethin i’ll look you up and maybe we’ll even disagree over a pint.

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        • again…. read the whole line, maybe read it slower next time or twice, not just what works for your argument.

          I didn’t say he is a threat to country music. I wrote:
          “I don’t not like Bob Wayne because he threatens country music, he is good for it, I just don’t like people like him, with reminders of who they think I should think they are.”

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          • fuck man, seriously, i left that part out cuz i thought it was a typo but i guess you intended to contradict yourself.. i mean how can he threaten and be good for country music simultaneously? i tried the olive branch and you fuckin threw it on the fire.

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          • don’t not… i see. maybe i should flush my stash. fuck it all anyways.

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          • haha. funny last comment. I can see how a quick glance at my “don’t not” could have been taken the wrong way.

            sorry for the kurt exchanges. I think we aired our grevinces. haha.

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    • It is not dividing walls. Rumors and bullshit on Facebook are dividing walls, because that is what Facebook is designed to do.

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  • I appreciate all the opinions on Monday’s interview. A lot of people ask where I stand, and I will tell you. I am simply standing exactly where I was before the whole XXX concept was brought to my attention.

    Let me explain. I am all for XXX. I got over the name, it’s fine with me. It certainly got all of our attention, who says that name can’t get more attention from a wider spectrum? But, am I gonna start calling my format on Outlaw Radio XXX music? No. Am I gonna stop backing Jason and Muddy Roots and start pushing for the XXX fest? Of course not. That would be silly. But, I do believe this format has a future, and I am willing to fight for it. I respect Shooter and thought he had a lot of guts to come on this board in the first place. He made his point clear and loud, and I think a lot of people liked what he had to say.

    As far as Adam Sheets, unfortunately, I have not had a lot of time to discuss this with him. I have a family and a job, I can’t be on the phone and the internet all day. I would like to talk to him soon and really get inside his head to see what his inner workings are. But, as far as I am concerned, he seems pretty cool and knows his shit. He seems a bit less “underground” than we are used to and that may be what people are upset about.He concentrates a lot of more mainstream artists on his site, but he also does have his share of underground blogs as well. He and Shooter are both welcoming my opinions with open arms however. They added 357 and Hellbound Glory to there “list” after my suggestion. When I get a chance, I will give an ultimate list of every band/artist that he and Shooter should listen to. I enjoy having a hand in picking artists, although, I do think Trig, myself, and Nix should have a larger hand in XXX.

    I noticed Rev’s comment on XXX tearing apart this “inner circle”. I do not agree. As a family, we are going to disagree from time to time. As much as it sucks, we are not always gonna be eye to eye. If I really thought that this would ruin my relationship with Nix, Trig, or any of you that I hold near to my heart, I would stay the fuck away from it. But, in my mind, it’s the same as one of us liking an album, and one of us thinking it is terrible. Words will be said, and arguments will take place, but in the end, we are ALWAYS a family.

    So, to sum everything up, I am staying where I was with backing XXX. My show WILL NOT change at all. If any of you feel the need to “stay away” from the chat and my show simply for my opinion, than that is a damn shame. I respect all of my listeners, but if something like this bothers you that much, than, there is nothing I can do to get you to stay on board. My number one goal, as it always has been, is to support these wonderful artists that deserve to be heard. That is why I think XXX should be backed. That is all they are trying to do, just on a slightly bigger scale. Helping bands get heard. Isn’t that why we started this “family” in the first place? It was never about us. It is about the music. Support the music.

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    • Amen !– support the music and the artists making it… all of this is just a means to an end…

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    • Well-said Jahshie. Thanks for that.

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      • I third that.

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        • I went to my local record store (ZIA records) today and tried finding your latest album, but all I found was the single for “don’t feed the animals”. I loved it, and I really enjoyed the remixes. I plan on purchasing the whole album soon. I love what you are doing! Good luck with XXX and keep fighting for what you believe in. Please come to Tucson when you go on tour.

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          • Jerry

            If you go to Shooterjennings.com on the home page there is a “jukebox”

            you can hear full versions of “wake up” and “all of this could have been yours” both from Black ribbons. and if anyone eles is interested there is also some old stuff and some from waylon forever also.

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  • I FINALLY have myself, my computer and the Internet in the same place and can begin regularly reading and commenting again. Nice timing, too, apparently.

    I’ve read the various articles and comments about this and I don’t have a whole lot to say other than I think it’s a great idea. It looks to be a push for the movement capable of carrying some momentum, and while no one can predict what end results will come from it, a good push isn’t going to hurt anything.

    I have no qualms with the name. Whatever sort of overall, umbrella term might wind up being used to describe the scene as a whole will come about whenever it comes about, so using the XXX label for this particular push doesn’t bother me any.

    I’m also not going to worry about nitpicking the list of bands and acts to be included in this. The fact is that there are a lot of bands out there and I don’t expect these guys to be walking encyclopedias of what is, for the most part, a recent musical movement. People like Jashie and Triggerman can talk with them and generate more bands for inclusion as things go along. I’m not going to get up in arms if a few artists I like aren’t mentioned right off the bat. Give the thing some time to unfold.

    I look forward to seeing how this plays out. I don’t look at is as some kind of replacement for the various mediums that have been used to disseminate the scene up to this point, I look at it as something to further compliment things.

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    • Bingo

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      • My computer is acting up, but wanted to say, to Burch, well said and very level headed.

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  • i was thinking long about this XXX thing and i have to say, that i still don’t like the idea of uniting so different kinds of music in one genre. espacially when i read on that XXX website that pantera should be in the same genre with dolly parton. i love both of them, but it just makes no sense for me.

    you could give the fans of the genre a name, but not the different kinds of music that they listen too. for example (i know, a bad one) a hippie doesn’t listen to the genre “hippie”, but we all know to what kind of musik a hippie listens to.

    and i also think this name was already given to the fans by hank III. he calls ‘em hellbillies and that’s a name that that explains this lifestyle pretty good i think. a hellbilly listens to a lot different music genres, including country, folk and bluegrass but also metal, punk and rockabilly for example.
    for me naming someone a hellbilly makes more sense, than founding a genre called XXX where joe buck is compared with six gunn britt.

    i also talked with bob wayne about this today and showed him, that his name is on the XXX website, but you should ask him for his opinion yourself. i don’t want to quote someone wrong here.

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  • I looked at the XXX Website and didn’t see the Goddamn Gallows on there or Jayke Orvis & The Broken Band. What’s up with that!? Good interview! As far as Shelton & Shooter go- Sometimes things just don’t work out. On to the next.

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  • Anyone seen/noticed that there are XXX playlists now available on iTunes? I just saw them this weekend while looking up artists. Appears Shooter has put them together. They are great variety and artists we all support. I am not sure how he complies them, but just thought I would bring it up.

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  • jb beverley and the wayward drifters are not on this list… im not a big shooter fan but i respect him alot more after this interview…

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